This is the same thing I tell those folks from the other side who are forever braying that they will never vote for Obama.

those who determine their choice of candidate in a general election on trivialities like what some idiot wrote on a blog or what was said in the heat of a campaign are fools.

And those saying they'd vote for McCain or abstain from voting instead of voting for the Dem in the general are, in the words of Hillary Clinton today, "foolish."

They're not "winning", they're behind by every conceivable measure. What Hillary managed today was to acquire a license to keep running until May 6th, when she'll get stomped in Indiana and North Carolina.

And the precise reason for that, or one of them, is the behavior you describe. They can't and won't change that.

is this a "real" question or bitching?  if its real, i think you make a legitimate point.  and if its a real question i will answer.

I gave up on Senator Clinton when her campaign put out that Bin Laden ad. Now, of course never say never, but you cannot possibly put out an ad like that and expect everything to be honky dory with people like me who have been sick to their stomach of these scare tactics

A very good friend, a seminarian, told me tonight he would riot if Supers gave Clinton the nomination.  I think universities would be a scary place to be if Obama is not nominated.  Any path for Clinton to get the nomination is not pretty.

Ayres is a terrorist and Wright is a bigot - those are facts. If facts are going to offend you, then you're going to have trouble supporting the Democratic nominee whoever it is.

Oh, one thing you should keep in mind about Sharpton (who I love) is that Republicans financed and ran his campaign in 2004. If Dems have problems with him, that's certainly part of the reason.

What is important to you? I get that you don't want to be insulted, no one does, but while there is a primary the candidates will be attacking each-other.  

I find the Lincoln bedroom, D-Punjab, cattle futures, Bill straying attacks petty and insulting, but not enough to turn me off of Obama. What turned me off of Obama was the Bradley effect/Bill and Hillary Clinton are using race to hurt me charges. I'm not a racist, most Democrats are not racists, and I take the implication personally. Not enough to vote for a Republican, but Obama's tactics are a tough bar to get over.

But my feelings are not the point. Obama's problem with Clinton voters is that his policy approach alienates working class people. He would have to move away from his centrist, free market oriented policies and embrace active government efforts to address the income gap and health care if he wanted to win the Democratic base.

There are probably things Hillary Clinton could do that would address your feelings. But the real question is what positions would she have to embrace to win the vote of people like you. My bet is that they have something to do with the war in Iraq.

Why do Obama and Clinton supporters only get to hold the Democratic party hostage by withholding their vote if their preferred candidate does not win?

I was an Edwards supporter.  I would hold my nose and vote for either Clinton or Obama.

Why are Obama and Clinton supporters so willing to take their vote and either stay home, or worse, vote for McCain?

I don't hear Edwards voters doing that.  Or Biden, or Richardson, or Dodd, etc, etc.

Here is what I would say to the Obama supporters.

It should be Hillary/Obama because

1)  We don't hate Obama.  Most Hillary supporters have a favorable idea of Obama.  That means we are not out to destroy Obama for the sake of destroying him.  I am less convinced the reverse is true.  

2)  The Hillary machine is known for being loyal.  If Obama draws the short straw and manages to get his voters to vote hillary we will remember.  Remembering means that next time around (after Hillary)  Obama becomes our new Hillary and we fight just as hard for him.  Not Edwards, not Gore, Obama would be our candidate, thats what we can trade.  Remembering means Obama comes too as VP.

3)  An Obama loss in the primary is likely a delay of 4 or 8 years and not a refuting of Obama the candidate IF he supports and his supporters support.  There never would have been an issue if they were both clearly going to support if they lost in the first place.

4)  If Obama runs and loses in the general for whatever reason his career is likely over.  He is an inspiration candidate with little solid foundation to base his claim on.  Four or eight years VP and distance form Rezko, Ayers, Wright, Democracygate, supportergate will benifit him IF he does so in a winning or sacrificing manner so that there is no stigma and no need for us to hold a grudge.

5)  He really can't win.  At this point Hillary won't get the nomination unless Obama really can't seal the deal.  But so far Obama can't.  And demographically there are a lot more women who haven't voted for Hillary than there are Blacks or liberals who haven't voted for Obama.  This and the fact that the states that will decide the election happen to favor Hillary genuinely hurts Obama's chances to win.  

6)  More of us won't vote for you than those of you who won't vote for us.  We didn't start this conditional support talk but we sure will finish it.  It may not seem fair at this stage of the game but some Obama supporters really poisoned the well for Obama with threats to not vote for Hillary if she won.  Its not personal its business and we won't vote for Obama.

7)  Politics really is a dirty game but forgiveness is key.  Many of the claims you guys make about Hillary are true, many of the claims we make about Obama are true.  We will forgive next time if you forgive this time, if you don't we won't ever forgive because this is Hillary's last best chance and it will always be on Obamas resume if he kills her career.  If we Hillary supporters go Edwards or Gore next cycle Obama will be frozen out yet again.

8)  Hillary really does win if you count all the votes.  The popular vote is a traditional metric in a primary and Hillary looks solid to finish with more total votes than Obama.

9)  Clinton/Obama is the only way to have both.  8 years from now Hillary won't be a credible candidate and Obama will.

10) we perceive you as having cheated.  Florida, Michigan and no revotes, Saying you won't support, Trying to force her out when you knew she was VERY strong, Trying to claim that if she fought for her chance it was ripping the party apart.  We perceive fairly or unfairly that this is power politics and that Hillary would not have used these tactics if the shoe were on the other foot.

11)  We have options and many of you don't.  John McCain isn't a scarey boogie man to us.  In fact if there is a rift in the democratic party the right 20% of us could just join the GOP and pull their center to the left enough that we could tolerate the candidates and the GOP would KILL every democratic candidate for decades.  This is an unlikely but real possibility and things like this have happened in the past.  So if there is a split in the party it will be my side that has their power GO UP and your side likely have their power GO DOWN.  Remember fair or not the center has options.

12)  Obama can bring his voters for a VP ticket more so that Hillary can bring hers for a VP ticket.  This is related to Obama losing in the primary is not losing its waiting.  You really can get Obama if he loses gracefully EVEN IF YOU FEEL ITS STOLEN.  Politics is about doing what gets the best outcome even if that isn't what feels best, if Obama loses the best outcome if you support him is for him to be on the ticket and all smiles.  If you support Obama and want him to one day be President thats your best path if he loses.  Again EVEN IF YOU FEEL ITS UNFAIR.

Which ever candidate prevails it will need to be seen as legitimate by the other candidates supporters. If Barack prevails in elected delegates but superdelegates give it to Clinton anyway there will be a revolt. Conversely if Clinton supporters believe that superdelegates are ganging up to push Hillary out they will revolt.

The fact of the matter is that neither candidate can knock the other out. Given the passion female voters rightly feel towards Hillary's candidacy and given the fact that female voters make up the majority of the Democratic electorate there is nothing Barack can say or do that will knock her out of the race. Given the strength Barack has with african american voters, more activist voters, new voters, and party crossovers there is nothing Hillary can say or do to knock him out.

My one fear is the nature of the Clinton campaign right now. Not the negativity but the fact that she goes around telling her supporters that Barack can't win. We are seeing the damage this is doing in the polls with the large portions of her voters that say they won't support Barack if he wins. The fact is that Hillary is no more qualified from an electability standpoint to be the nominee then he is but he has, rightly, refused to use this argument against her.

In the end only two things will end this process, either it goes another 6 weeks until the last contest or the Clinton campaign runs out of cash which it is close to doing. It depends on how much debt the Clintons are willing to rack up. They are at about 16 million as of the end of March.

"The fact is that Hillary is no more qualified from an electability standpoint to be the nominee then he is but he has, rightly, refused to use this argument against her."

But, for how much longer?

As the front runner, he has had to play nice (in spite of what the Clinton supporters think) but if she is, as you say, hurting him the GE, then he as a devil of a choice?

Amp up against her, and drive her supporters even further away, or stay above it, and let her keep chewing away at him.

He's in a tough spot, but, I guess this is not for the feint hearted.

Obama is responsible for his own loss in PA and it was not negative campaigning.  His own big mouth in San Francisco did all the work.

One more thought, although the DNC said the Florida and Michigan delegates wouldn't count they never said that about the popular vote.  I don't doubt that the Super Delegates are including the popular vote totals in Florida and Michigan in their calculations.  Hillary is going to end up with a lead in the popular vote and Obama will end up with a 50 to 75 delegate lead.  It's going to be a Hillary/Obama ticket and the Democratic Party can put a lock on the White House for the next sixteen years.  Obama has plenty of time.  

A UNITY TICKET IS THE ANSWER.

HILLARY GOES FIRST, BARACK GOES 2ND.

SHE'S OLDER AND HAS THE EXPERIENCE.